Time to take the fight to the courts, I guess.

Right you are, Irtnog.  It’s a shame it has gotten this far.

This battle is not going to be fought in letters to the editor or message boards. My questions are, who is going take the fight to the courts? Do you have any faith in the corporate court system, where judges legislate and attempt to rewrite the Constitution from the bench?

Not really, Don, but how can we change that?  The anti-fluoride groups should be the ones to take this to court, they are well-organized and have the facts necessary to jostle consciences and perhaps change minds.

Yes, anti-fluoride groups, such as Skagit Clean Water (.org) have the necessary facts, but they are made up of common folk like you and me. Where is the money going to come from to “fight the battle?” Until those who are opposed to fluoridation show some support for the “foot soldiers” or actively join the fight, they should not expect anything more than what exists right now. In the meantime, people can find a wealth of information at http://www.skagitcleanwater.org/ and http://www.fluoridealert.org/

I will definitely join the fight with my time and money.

Now, what about the contract the County signed with the critical
timeline to get the Fluoridation implement without assessed penalties?
Don do you have a copy or a link to that sign contract?

Quote-"This past May, county commissioners, acting as the Board of Health, gave the PUD one year to implement fluoridation in Sedro-Woolley, Burlington, Mount Vernon and surrounding areas. Refusal to comply could lead to fines.”

I thought it was only for people who received Judy Reservoir water and that not all of these people in the ‘surrounding areas’ etc. had gotten to vote on the issue. Will people be getting this water without their vote on it?

Resolution #20070284 contains the wording for the unlawful fluoridation “mandate” including penalties for “any person or other entity that violates” it. I suppose that could be taken to mean any private citizen who attempts to have it overturned. The complete text for Munks’ and Dahlstedt’ breach of the public’s trust can be found at the bottom of Weyrich’s request to the AGO. See http://www.skagitcleanwater.org/law-library/2007-11-27--AGO-Request-Signed.pdf

Good, Irtnog! One thing we can do to minimize expenses is to mount an offensive to have Dahlstedt, Weyrich, Browning, and Leibrand all removed from their positions of power. One has to keep in mind that the courts have a long history of serving corporate interests at the expense of those they supposedly work for. By his own admission, McKenna says that the so-called “police powers statute,” RCW 70.05.060, is broad in scope. That has left it wide open for abuse and exploitation by power hungry public policy makers. See http://www.skagitcleanwater.org/fluoride-101/gih-tracy-garland.html . Munks and Dahlstedt rolled out the red carpet for the WDSF. Unfortunately, the Constitutionally protected rights of individuals like you and me have been smothered under its weight.

When is the last time that a community was under quarantine as the result of runaway tooth decay? BOH mandates were intended to address such things as serious outbreaks of the plague, tuberculosis, or the 1918 influenza pandemic. The outcome of Kaul v. Chehalis, 45 Wash. 2d 616, 621, 277 P.2d 352 (1954) set another dangerous precedent when the Washington State Supreme Court ruled that fluoridation of a public water supply is not unconstitutional. Dissenting Judge Matthew Hill observed correctly, “What the residents of Chehalis would not be compelled to do one by one, it is now sought to compel them to do en masse . . . This smacks more of the police state than of the police power.” If we let our BOH get away with this outrage, we deserve whatever else they come up with!

The facts are that fluoridation is safe and effective.  And fluoridation will save money by helping lower health care bills, will reduce pain and school absences, and improve the oral health of everyone, young and old.

Did you come up with that yourself, richiem999, or did you get that off the toilet stall partition at Washington Dental Service Foundation? Here’s a little IQ test for you....
FACT: Before modern drugs hit the market, fluoride was once the standard treatment for hyperthyroidism
FACT: The “optimal” fluoride level touted by pro-fluoridationists exceeds the dosage used to treat hyperthyroidism
Q: Are people who drink fluoridated water being treated for hyperthyroidism without their informed consent?
Q: Are people with undiagnosed hypothyroidism who drink fluoridated water being made even more sick, perhaps to the point of being left bedridden?
(Hint: The answer to both questions is “UNQUESTIONABLY”)

I challenge anyone to present clinical evidence to the contrary.

richiem,
Safe and effective? They are just hollow words, too bad you can’t back them up with any facts. Even if it were true (which it isn’t) that fluoride fights cavities what good does it do if they end up with bone cancer or endocrine system problems? Cancer is the worst thing we have going now, its of epidemic proportions, why push the envelope? I can’t believe there are actually people buying into the insanity of poisoning the water! What could possibly be the motive?

Don,
It doesn’t do any good to ask a pro-fluoride person to any present clinical evidence to give them any credibility. In the last few years I have tried to ask pro-fluoride people questions and they turn tail and run or simply ignore me. That is what they have been taught to do and they do it without questioning the motives of their educators, blind faith, its a shame.

Jo and Don:
Come down out of the hysteria.  All the scare mongering doesn’t befit you.  Want proof it is safe?  Try 180 million people in this country who drink fluoridated water.  Try more than 60 years of use without ANY CREDIBLE evidence to back up the scare tactics that the anti crowd posts on the Internet. If what you claim were true the evidence would be there, but it IS NOT.  For every “scientist” who “backs up” your claims are HUNDREDs if not THOUSANDS who look at the facts and understand the anti claims are a load of bunk.  Question all you want, but understand that just because you question something doesn’t mean you have the right answer.

Knock off the ridicule, richiem999. That line of argument is for people like you who have no case. All you have provided are meaningless endorsements. Instead of asserting hysteria on our parts, show us the double-blinded scientific studies that back up your wild claims. You won’t because they do not exist. Ask the real scientists who do the actual research ( http://nteu280.org/Issues/Fluoride/NTEU280-Fluoride.htm ). It is a medical fact that there is an epidemic of hypothyroidism in this country and the 180 million fluoridated water drinkers you cite most likely make up the bulk of the victims. Synthroid has been the #2 or #3 top-prescribed drug for over a decade. I dare you to prove me wrong. And please use your real name so that we know you are not a true coward.

richiem999, Based on medical fact, I challenged you to refute the logical conclusion that fluoridating people’s drinking water is subjecting them to a treatment for hyperthyroidism without their consent. Do you have the giblets? I don’t think you do.

One more time:
FACT: Before modern drugs hit the market, fluoride was once the standard treatment for hyperthyroidism
FACT: The “optimal” fluoride level touted by pro-fluoridationists exceeds the dosage used to treat hyperthyroidism
Q: Are people who drink fluoridated water being treated for hyperthyroidism without their informed consent?
Q: Are people with undiagnosed hypothyroidism who drink fluoridated water being made even more sick, perhaps to the point of being left bedridden?

Don:  I appreciate your passion, but in terms of ridicule, you anti-fluoridationists engage in it far more than anyone else: “power hungry public policy makers,” “did you get that off the toilet stall partition at WDSF,” etc. from your previous posts.  And your “medical facts” are bogus.  Yes, you can find web sites that say Synthroid is #2 most prescribed.  But you can also find credible sites that list it anywhere from #7 (Pharmacy Times) to not even in the top 40 (RXList).  Why the disparity?  Because a lot of people have agendas.  Because there are a lot of different ways to count.  (continued on next post...)

(continued...) But the real issue is not where Synthroid ranks, but why:  Here is what Dr. Marvin Kirschner of the University of Medicine and Dentistry NJ, the largest health sciences university in the country, says:  “Overweight patients tell their physicians, ‘I don’t know why I’m so heavy, I must have a glandular problem,’” states Kirschner. “In response to these pleas, the physician prescribes Synthroid.” Dr. Kirschner adds that Synthroid has long been discounted as a remedy for weight loss, but it is still being used improperly by probably millions of Americans.  Sorry, but your bogus science about hyperthyroidism has been exposed.  But you won’t believe because it doesn’t line up with your “facts”.

Fluoride good?  Fluoride bad?  Who cares?  Fluoride’s benefits or lack of benefits isn’t the issue for me.  The issue is somebody wanting to put something in my water that I don’t want to drink.  The Commissioners can call themselves the Board of Health, the Grand Exalted Triumvirate, or whatever else makes them feel important but they DON’T have the right to put medication in my water.

I suppose they don’t have the right to filter out dirt, either.  My, my, my—“my” water.  It is the community’s water, the community of which you are but one member.  The community voted in favor of fluoridating the water.  If the community votes in favor of a school levy, do you have the right to not pay the increased taxes because you opposed it?  No.  You can keep moving your arguments from one point to the next, but they all boil down to the same thing—you want impose your minority viewpoint on everyone else.

Filter dirt out?  There’s a completely asinine comparison.

Suppose a majority of the community voted to cut off our right arms?  I suppose you’d just be happy as hell to go along with the crowd?

Talk about asinine—keep propping up those straw man arguments, like “cut off our right arms.” Who died and willed you the dictatorship for Skagit County?  Here’s a valid ccomparison—chlorine.  Chlorine is a disinfectant added to drinking water to reduce or eliminate bacteria and viruses.  Should that be left out simply because you don’t like it?  Claims of health impacts by anti-fluoridationists are bogus.  Parse it all you want, find all the black helicopter Internet conspiracy sites you want, it’s still bunk.

richiem999, what’s your agenda?  I fail to believe that you are just an honest joe who has an opinion, you’re part of the problem, aren’tcha?  Irtnog is right on, the big deal with this issue isn’t whether or not fluoride is dangerous, it’s whether or not anyone should have the right to force a medication on an unwilling population.  They claim they can force fluoride on us because it will somehow prevent a communicable disease.  Now THAT’S what I call BOGUS.  Forced fluoridation is completely unconstitutional, and I cannot fathom WHY you can’t see that.

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